again with that? You think that’s your magnum opus, don’t you?
Reply
gordon
If we can’t do away with the save altogether, can we at least eliminate the possibility of a save in games won by 27 runs?
Reply
M. Scott Eiland
I remember Bill James writing about the complaints about saves being awarded in blowout games, and after twenty-five years or so his response still makes sense to me: why don’t you hear the people who complain about some guy getting a save in an 18-3 game complaining when some starting pitcher gets a win in a game where he gives up seven runs in five plus innings and his teammates score a pile of runs for him? Cheap wins are far more common than cheap saves–you can’t get a save by blowing a lead, for one thing–but all of the old curmudgeons have hissy fits every time some guy throws the last three innings of a blowout and gets a save for it. Fact is, the guy who got the save in the 30-3 game pitched a lot better than the one who got the win–why *shouldn’t* he get a save for it?
Actually, I do complain when pitchers get wins they don’t deserve.
Reply
M. Scott Eiland
I wasn’t really directing that rant at you, David–tweaking the rule so that the “pitching effectively” part of the definition is enforced more carefully would be a decent reform (as would changing the win rule so that a relief pitcher can’t gain eligibility for a win by surrendering a lead). However, I’ve been hearing complaining about the save in a 30-3 game for over twenty four hours now, and it reminded me of Bill James’ old comments.
again with that? You think that’s your magnum opus, don’t you?
If we can’t do away with the save altogether, can we at least eliminate the possibility of a save in games won by 27 runs?
I remember Bill James writing about the complaints about saves being awarded in blowout games, and after twenty-five years or so his response still makes sense to me: why don’t you hear the people who complain about some guy getting a save in an 18-3 game complaining when some starting pitcher gets a win in a game where he gives up seven runs in five plus innings and his teammates score a pile of runs for him? Cheap wins are far more common than cheap saves–you can’t get a save by blowing a lead, for one thing–but all of the old curmudgeons have hissy fits every time some guy throws the last three innings of a blowout and gets a save for it. Fact is, the guy who got the save in the 30-3 game pitched a lot better than the one who got the win–why *shouldn’t* he get a save for it?
Actually, I do complain when pitchers get wins they don’t deserve.
I wasn’t really directing that rant at you, David–tweaking the rule so that the “pitching effectively” part of the definition is enforced more carefully would be a decent reform (as would changing the win rule so that a relief pitcher can’t gain eligibility for a win by surrendering a lead). However, I’ve been hearing complaining about the save in a 30-3 game for over twenty four hours now, and it reminded me of Bill James’ old comments.