Baseball Musings: Exchanging Info

December 04, 2007

Exchanging Info

The Red Sox and Twins talks haven't stalled:

It was after midnight in the Music City, and the Red Sox and Minnesota Twins were exchanging medical information on pitchers Johan Santana and Jon Lester, indicating that the clubs may be closing in on a deal for the two-time Cy Young Award winner.
more stories like thisThe Sox and Twins were locked in negotiations after the Yankees refused to include another top prospect, pitcher Ian Kennedy, in a package that already included top pitching prospect Phil Hughes and center fielder Melky Cabrera.

It was uncertain whether the Sox also were including center fielder Jacoby Ellsbury in their offer.

I don't understand why Lester-Ellsbury is a better headline for the Twins than Hughes-Cabrera. I could see the Twins jumping at Buchholz-Ellsbury, but if it's L&E, I'm going back to the Yankees and taking Hughes.

Update: Here's a later update from Gordon Edes:

There were indications that the Twins would be getting center fielder Coco Crisp, pitcher Justin Masterson and infielder Jed Lowrie in addition to Lester, the winner of the Series-clinching Game 4 and a favorite of pitching coach John Farrell. But that was not confirmed. Repeat, That has not yet been confirmed. We're working on it.

Edes thinks an announcement could come this morning.

Posted by David Pinto at 08:05 AM | Trades | TrackBack (0)

Comments

Is this some kind of sick joke?

Posted by: Yankee Fan in Chicago at December 4, 2007 08:44 AM

Last i heard it wasn't even Lester Ellsbury. It was the original offer of Lester, Crisp, Lowrie, and another Minor Leaguer.

Posted by: Brian at December 4, 2007 08:50 AM

Brian, I heard both of those packages were still in play.

Though I'm a YF too, to me Lester + Ellsbury does seem comparable to Hughes + Cabrera. Hughes > Lester, but Ellsbury > Cabrera (in terms of possible up-side -- I think you pretty much know what you're getting with Cabrera). Since in general position players with good MiL records are less risky than pitching prospects, the Twins could feel safer with the Sox' package than with the Yanks'.

Posted by: James at December 4, 2007 09:07 AM

Ellsbury is looked at as having a lot more upside than Cabrera and before he got sick I think Lester was rated close to HUghes as a prospect.

Posted by: Tom at December 4, 2007 09:10 AM

Coco Crisp? Jeez loiuse, I thought Melky was kind of a joke as trade bait for Santana. Couldn't Minnesota get better value if they looked beyond the Yanks and Sox?

Posted by: Casey Abell at December 4, 2007 09:16 AM

Hm, managed to misspell louise.

Posted by: Casey Abell at December 4, 2007 09:35 AM

The thing with Melky is he can't bat at the top or the middle of the order - he's decent/good in CF but he's not as good as Crisp in the OF - Twins have no SS so maybe they want Lowrie

Posted by: Bandit at December 4, 2007 10:05 AM

I think this comes down to the additional pieces more than the centerpiece guys. Hughes is a better prospect than Lester, but it's not like the difference is huge. Cabrera is younger than Crisp, but their OPS was nearly identical last year and Crisp's defense was better so you could say those 2 are close to a wash.

Lowrie is a good shortstop middle infield prospect who has a good bat and is seen as close to major league ready and Masterson is a very good relief prospect. I know that Keith Law from ESPN is high on him as someone who could pitch in relief at the major league level in 2008.

I think that if the Twins take the Red Sox deal it will be because they think Masterson and Lowrie more than overcome the difference between Hughes/Cabrera and Lester/Crisp.

Posted by: Tom at December 4, 2007 10:12 AM

Well, yeah, but why should the Twins limit themselves to the Yanks and Sox in the first place? I really don't want to go to my fans and say, we got Melky/Coco for one of the best pitchers in the history of the game.

If this is all that's on the table from the Big Two, I start looking for another table. Or I just take another season of Santana (not a horrible prospect) and the compensation picks.

Posted by: Casey Abell at December 4, 2007 10:22 AM

There's a story on mlb.com that the Twins might be shopping Joe Nathan to the Astros. Maybe they can get Chris Burke!

Posted by: Casey Abell at December 4, 2007 10:47 AM

If you think Crisps' defense is that much better than Melky's you're fooling yourself considering Melky has one of the best arms in the game and isn't a butcher out there (not to mention 23 yrs old). A Hughes/Melky deal trumps a Lester/Crisp centered deal any day of the week.

Posted by: Ben at December 4, 2007 10:52 AM

@Casey

You think twins are going to the post season next year? santana,nathan,morneau, neshek..maybe liriano and mauer depending on health, are all awesome. If the twins are not going to the post season next year then you must trade him now. I say this just because Santana said somewhere that he would only play for yankees/sox and that he would not waive his no-trade midway through next season.

Any of these fine prospect packages is going to be better than draft pick compensation. lester+ellsbury + masterson and lowrie, that's a lot of talent! Plus, santana is a free agent after next year, right? just how much do you give up for a one year rental when you've already just won the world series, and the other was ever so close.

Posted by: Evan at December 4, 2007 12:21 PM

One thing's for sure: the Twins don't go to the postseason next year without Santana. And if a fringe player like Coco Crisp headlines the talent package you get for Santana, you've got a major p.r. problem, not to mention a baseball problem. The team already waved good-bye to Hunter, who may have been overrated but did have an okay year in 2007. How exactly are they going to sell tickets in 2008? The new ballpark may hype ticket sales in 2010, but you need a few attractions to peddle tickets next year.

Posted by: Casey Abell at December 4, 2007 12:53 PM

By the way, mlb.com quotes Santana's agent as saying that the pitcher would be willing to go to other teams besides the Yanks and Sox. So why not look around further before taking Coco or Melky?

Posted by: Casey Abell at December 4, 2007 12:57 PM

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