Baseball Musings
Baseball Musings
June 03, 2004
Let's Not Bid on Vlad

Just how smart was Arte Moreno? Just how dumb were the rest of the owners? There should have been a bidding war for his talent, if for no other reason that to assure the team that got him paid for it. But no, he might be hurt, we really don't have the money. So the Angels got a $20 million ballplayer for $14 million a year, leaving them extra money to put some good, young cheap talent on their roster. Moreno saw an opportunity to buy low, when everyone else just saw something they couldn't afford. But the reality is that any major league team could have had Guerrero for no more than $16 million, and that would still be a bargain.


Posted by David Pinto at 09:55 AM | Free Agents | TrackBack (0)
Comments

To this day I don't know why the Yankees didn't try and sign him. I heard rumors that he may not have wanted to play in NY, but still, you have to at least TRY to get one of the best players in the game. Instead they got Shef, who isn't a bad player, but is old and isn't nearly as good as Vlad is.

Posted by: sabernar at June 3, 2004 10:42 AM

Well put.

Posted by: tjlang at June 3, 2004 11:38 AM

What about the Orioles? My impression (admittedly that of an Os fan) is that Vlad didn't even give them a chance to match the Angels' offer -- he used different agents to negotiate the deals, and it seemed like the Orioles front office didn't even know about the other negotiations until it was a done deal. Clearly they were trying not to overpay, but given Vlad's (and his agents') approach, I'm not sure that they could have gotten him for $16 mil. They didn't even get a chance to up their offer.

Posted by: RS at June 3, 2004 11:46 AM

I wonder if Vlad's (seemingly) quite nature cost him here. Granted, $14M a year is a lot of money, but it's definitely not the $20M or so a year he's worth. I think the Yankees or Orioles (Dodgers, etc) would have been more likely to bid for his services if he came across as the type of player, like an ARod for example, who would do all the things in the community (which I have no idea if Vlad does or not) and be a spokesperson for the team. Vlad seems to be more cut from the same cloth as guys like Manny Ramirez (not that Vlad has his issues), in the sense that he's quiet and stays out of the mix.

I think most owners want more of a PR committment from a guy they're going to pay such top dollar to - the expectations are for more than just on the field performance.

Posted by: Mike at June 3, 2004 12:53 PM

Fellas, Arte Moreno is a latino...duh. Last I checked, Steinbrenner, Wilpon, et al. were not. Simply put, Vlad felt more comfortable working for a guy who could speak to his mom in her language. He's very close to his mom. Sometimes it's not about the money.

Posted by: johnny c at June 3, 2004 05:19 PM

Arte is a third-generation American -- and barely speaks Spanish!

I heard Arte attempt to conduct an interview in Spanish on Spanish-language television in the L.A. area. Arte could barely carry on a conversation in Spanish. Instead, broadcaster Jose Mota had to come to his aid time and time again, finishing most of his sentences for him.

The notion that he speaks Spanish fluently and can converse with his Latino players is a myth.

Posted by: gb at June 3, 2004 06:35 PM

Heading into the off-season, I was convinced that the fix was in for Vlad winding up in Baltimore, as a bone thrown to Peter Angelos so that he wouldn't block the Expos move. After all, nothing like signing the Best Player Not Named Barry or Alex to a multi-year deal at below-market value to take the sting away from giving up any and all claims to Washington D.C. And when there wasn't much public bidding for Vlad's services, it seemed to support my wild-eyed conspiracy theory.

And then Arte Moreno comes along and signs Vlad, and I'm reminded once again that most baseball owners couldn't collude to order lunch, let alone conspire to have a top-tier free agent wind up in a pre-approved destination.

Posted by: Philip M. at June 3, 2004 06:43 PM

You're giving Moreno too much credit for this. Bill Stoneman called Vlad's agent because he was inquiring about Palmiero, who was also his client. Palmiero’s deal with the O’s had already been finalized, and that's when Vlad's agent suggested that Anaheim was Vlad's first choice (makes sense, how many Dominicans live in the Baltimore area?) and asked Stoneman to make an offer. Stoneman got a quick OK from Moreno, and the deal was made that night. Moreno had little to do with the negotiations, and nothing to do with contacting Vlad’s agent in the first place.

It looks like Guerrero was willing to take less to play in Southern California, so I’m not sure a $16 million offer would have cut it.

Posted by: Richard at June 3, 2004 08:40 PM

don't buy now, pay later (so to speak)

Posted by: lisa gray at June 3, 2004 09:02 PM

Vlad's worth $20M? To how many teams? Being a Padres fan, I don't think he'd be worth $15-$20M to us -- that is 1/4 to 1/3 of the team's entire sustainable payroll.

Yes, we'd rather have Vlad and somebody than Phil Nevin and Ryan Klesko, but I think every team needs to plan for some payroll mistakes. On the flip, would you rather have Vlad than Brian Giles, David Wells, Akinori Otsuka and Rod Beck? That's $15 - $20M right there.

Posted by: Alan at June 3, 2004 11:21 PM

Didn't the expos offer him 15 million a year? He turned them down to take 14 mil? I think since he turned down the 15 mil everyone was expecting him to go for at least 17 mil. Nobody wanted to bid that.

Posted by: Daniel at June 4, 2004 03:22 AM

Even if the Angels got a discount on Vlad, they also happened to overpay for Garrett Anderson. Vlad for 14 and GA for 12, or Vlad for 17 and GA for 9.... same thing.

It's like winning with house money, and then letting it ride.

Posted by: Tangotiger at June 4, 2004 11:22 PM

Vladimir Guerrero has a chance for the triple crown this year. He is leading the AL in rbi's and is only 1 homer behind Manny Ramirez and the 3 batters ahead of him in batting average...Melvin Mora, Alex Sanchez and Ken Harvey would really surprise me if they hit these averages for whole year and being only 23 points behind Mora that is not that big of a lead for Mora who probably will falter during rest of season. With Troy Glaus out of action, picking up Guerrero may make a huge difference in coming weeks.

Posted by: Andrew Godfrey at June 5, 2004 12:39 PM

I think Guerrero's back condition made the Orioles hesitant to pay absolute top dollar (and years) for him, given their recent history of expensive injury busts (Albert Belle, Scott Erickson, David Seguí) and owner Peter Angelos's reliance on medical reports.

Remember when the Orioles rescinded a multi-year offer to Aaron Sele because an MRI showed wear in Sele's shoulder? Angelos was behind that. As it turned out, Sele pitched great for the Mariners for two years, but in 2002 he missed several starts due to that shoulder, which eventually required surgery. Now he's back strong—coincidentally, with the Angels.

That doesn't really explain the signing of Seguí, who had all sorts of injury red flags when they signed him. I think it was a move rooted in desperation due to the lack of interest from other free agents. You may recall Syd Thrift's line about the Orioles having "Confederate money." But in general, Angelos is reluctant to give long-term deals to guys with iffy medical reports. Miguel Tejada had no such question marks, so he was green-lighted all the way.

In Guerrero's case, don't forget that back injuries can be chronic and debilitating. The Angels are getting good value for their money right now, but it's still the first year of the deal. If Guerrero's back problems recur in the next five years, the contract may become much less of a bargain.

Posted by: The Birds Watcher at June 6, 2004 10:58 PM