Baseball Musings
Baseball Musings
March 09, 2004
Twin Winnings

Seth Speaks takes a look at the Twins playoff history and picks his all time Twins playoffs team. One thing I disagee with:


Zoilo Versalles won the 1965 American League MVP award. He had a really great season. Believe me, if it happened now, SABRmetricians would probably take issue with that decision.

Of course that's nonsense. Versalles had 32 win shares that year. The only AL player that I can find with more is his teammate, Tony Oliva. Versalles was a shortstop, which would probably put him over the top. I can't think of a sabermetrician who would argue against his receiving that award.


Posted by David Pinto at 03:38 PM | Post Season | TrackBack (0)
Comments

Seth Speaks also makes the statement:

"Tony Oliva should be in the Hall of Fame. No, not just from these seasons, but for his whole career. Another guy who wouldn’t take a walk, Oliva could flat-out hit and had a rocket for an arm. Of course, he retired before I was born."

I remember watching Oliva when I was a young kid and definitely liked him as a player. He was a very good player. But the evidence doesn't make a strong case for him being in the HoF.

From Baseball-Reference.com, the ten most similar hitters to Oliva are:
Carl Furillo (928)
Gus Bell (916)
Bob Watson (902)
Andy Pafko (900)
Pedro Guerrero (899)
George Bell (898)
Moises Alou (898)
Rico Carty (896)
George Kelly (892) *
Dante Bichette (890)
Only one is in the HoF--George Kelly, who most people agree should not be in the HoF.

Bill James (New BJ Historical Baseball Abstract) ranks Oliva as the 21st best RF of all time, behind non-HoF players such as Dave Parker, Bobby Bonds, Bobby Mercer, Ken Singleton, Andre Dawson, and Reggie Smith. Moreover, Oliva's career WS are lower than those of Dwight Evans, Rusty Staub, Rocky Colavito, and Jack Clark, who James ranks a little below Oliva. Oliva's career WS are similar to Pedro Guerrero, Roger Maris, Jose Canseco, and Ken Griffey Sr.

Oliva had a fine career and is in the company of many other good, but non-HoF, players. Objective analysis of Oliva's career doesn't make the case that he should be in the HoF.

Posted by: eric at March 9, 2004 04:54 PM

Dave,

Though I agree with you, especially after the Win Share arguement, I think there is something to be said for implying Sabermetricians wouldn't like a guy who had an OBP of .319 and led the league in strikeouts. Especially when there was a guy out there that led the league in OBP, SLG, OPS, Adjusted OPS, Doubles and was second in extra base hits, and BA. Oh, and won a Gold Glove.

Posted by: Bill at March 9, 2004 05:13 PM